Trial of Clarence Norris, December 2, 1933 before Judge William Washington Callahan.
Direct Examination:
My name is Mrs. Victoria Price. I live at Huntsville, Alabama, and lived there on the 25th day of March, 1931. On the 25th of March, 1931, I was riding on a freight train that was traveling through Jackson County, Alabama, to Paint Rock, Alabama. I was on that train when it reached Stevenson. Ruby Bates was riding with me on that train. After the train left Stevenson, Alabama, coming this way in the direction of Paint Rock, I was riding in a gondola car. Ruby Bates and several white boys were in the car with me. The car had chert in it, what I heard called chert. It laced about a foot and half or 3 feet of being full. I saw this defendant on that occasion, Clarence Norris. When I first saw him on that train, running between Stevenson and Paint Rock, they was coming over the box car; the defendant and some more colored men. There was twelve colored men at that time, to the best of my count and recollection.
Q: Did all of these twelve come over into that gondola car?
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to that.
Court: I'll overrule the objection.
Mr. Leibowitz: We except.
A: Yes, Sir.
Q: Did you see him strike any of the white boys?
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to that. He is putting the answer in her mouth. I want to ask that the witness be instructed by the Court to answer "Yes or no."
Court: I am not going to give any such instructions as that. I will wait and see what she says. (To witness) You don't have to answer "Yes, sir," or "No, sir." Just answer the questions asked you.
A: All these twelve men jumped into the gondola over mine and Ruby Bates' head.
Q: Did you hear any of them say anything as they came into the gondola car?
Mr. Leibowitz: I am objecting to all this, you Honor, unless this defendant is the one that said it.
Court: I'll overrule the objection.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception
A: Yes, sir, as they came over, I did. Some one of them, I don't know which one it was, he said, "All You white sons of bitches unload."
Q: Did either of these men have any pistols, or guns that you saw?
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to that.
Court: Overruled.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception
A: Two of them had pistols to the best of my recollection. I wouldn't be positive that this defendant had a pistol. Some of them had knives in their hands as they got into the gondola car. I wouldn't say, but to the best of my knowledge some of them had them open. After one of them said, "All you white sons of bitches unload," the following then happened on that car, between this man or anybody else: they knocked them off and begun to run up and down the side to see that they did not get back on, i.e., the white boys they had knocked off, except Gilley. Then they commenced to attack us girls, me and Ruby Bates. They put their hands on me. After they got the white boys off, I went to the corner of the gondola to get over, and one of the crowd in the back of the car, "We are not going to hurt you," and when I started to make my jump he hit me, he hit me, and one of them pulled off my clothes, my overalls--
Mr. Leibowitz: I object to "one of them" or "somebody"; this defendant is on trial and what he did is the issue.
Court: I'll overrule the objection.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
The testimony continued as follows: They taken my overalls off and then they taken me and threw me over on the chert, and one of them held my legs, and one held a knife on me there, and then one of them raped me and Ruby Bates.
Mr. Leibowitz: We move to strike out "Ruby Bates."
Court: Overruled.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
Q: Did this defendant have sexual intercourse with you?
A: Yes, sir.
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to that as leading.
Court: Overruled.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
A: His private part penetrated my private part.
Q: While he was having sexual intercourse with you, was anyone holding you in any way?
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to that as leading. He is putting the answer in her mouth.
Court: I'll overrule the objection.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
A: One of them held a knife at my throat and one of them held my legs. I had on a pair of step-ins, three dresses, a pair of overalls, shirt, girl's coat and a girl's hat. I got off of that train at Paint Rock.
Q: Were these colored men in the car, the gondola car, where you were, when the train came to a stop?
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to that as leading. He is putting the answer in her mouth. Court: Overruled. Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
A: They were running out of the gondola car towards the engine when the train stopped.
Q: All of them?
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to that.
Court: Overruled.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
A: Yes, sir. When the train stopped I straightened up and I got up in the gondola and was looking to see what was going on, and I started over the side of the gondola to get off, and when I got to the last step I fell, and I didn't know anything else until I come to myself in Paint Rock, in a store. That store was some distance from the depot and the track.
Q: How many of them had sexual intercourse with you on that car on that occasion
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to that.
A: Six,, to the best of my recollection. Well the train stopped at Paint ?rock in five or ten minutes after they had stopped having sexual intercourse. I had done put my clothes on me and got to one side. This fellow Gilley and Ruby Bates helped me. Orville Gilley is a white man. When Ruby Bates and I got into that gondola car at Stevenson no one else was in there. No one else got in there from the time the seven whit boys got in, until these colored men came into the car. We was in the end of that car towards the caboose of the train when the seven white boys got into it; in the gondola, on the chert. When the white boys got in the car they climbed in and lay down on their stomachs feet towards us, and their heads towards the engine, they were in the other end. That is about the position we were in that car when these colored boys came into it.
Cross-Examination by Mr. Leibowitz:
A: My true name is not Mrs. Price. I am not Mrs. Price; my husband's name is not Price. My husband's name is McCLendon. His first name is Enna. I was married to Mr. McClendon in Huntsville, Alabama. I don't know how long it was before this rape that I was married to Mr. McClendon; I had been married to him over a year or two. I did not assume the name of McClendon. I never went by my husband's name. I had another husband, too. His name was Henry Presley. I married him in Fayetteville, Tennessee. I don't know exactly how long before I married my second husband I married my first husband. It was a couple of years. I wouldn't be positive. I was married by a justice. I cannot give you the date of that marriage. I did not have any other husband besides those two. I did not ever use the name of Presley, my first husband's name.
Q: Who did you start out to Chattanooga with the day before--I withdraw that--you ever been convicted of a crime?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: Sustained.
Mr. Leibowitz: I haven't finished my question.
Court: It sounded like it to me.
Q: Weren't you convicted of a crime involving moral turpitude--Look this way please, not over that way!
Court: Now, Mr. Leibowitz, don't proceed along that line any more.
Q: Were you ever convicted of a crime involving moral turpitude, under the name of Victoria Presley, in the year 1972?
Mr. Knight: I object to that.
Court: I doubt whether this witness knows what moral turpitude is; I doubt whether half the lawyers know it or not.
Mr. Leibowitz: That is on the question of credibility.
Court: Ask if she has been convicted and I can then determine whether that involves moral turpitude.
Q: What were you convicted of?
Mr. Knight: I object to that.
Court: I sustain the objection.
Mr. Leibowitz: Your Honor just told me to ask it.
Court: No, not that way--you misunderstood me.
Mr. Leibowitz: May I have an answer to my previous question?
Court: You can ask her if she has ever been convicted of a certain offense, and I can then determine whether you can ask that kind of question.
Q: Were you ever convicted of the crime of adultery?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: I sustain the objection. (To the Jury) Gentlemen of the jury, when a question is asked and I sustain an objection to that question, that question and all that involves and all inferences from it, it out of the case, and not evidence in the case, and you must not consider it in arriving at your verdict.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
Q: Were you ever convicted of the crime of fornication?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: Sustained.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception
Q: Were you ever convicted for a violation of the prohibition law?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: Sustained.
Mr. Leibowitz: exception.
Q: Were you ever convicted of vagrancy and drunkenness?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: Sustained.
Mr. Leibowitz: exception
Q: Were you ever convicted of any crime under the name of Victoria Presley?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: Sustained.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception
[The testimony then continued:]
I wasn't working on March 24, 1931, neither was Ruby Bates. I did not leave my home town which is Huntsville, on March 24, 1931, with a man named Lester Carter. [Lester Carter is brought in.] [Clarence Norris states: Leibowitz and the lawyers ...] I know Lester Carter when I see him. That is he. I did not see Lester Carter at the time I left Huntsville on the freight train to go to Chattanooga. He was not, at any time, with me and Ruby Bates, on the same freight car going to Chattanooga; if he was I didn't know him. If I had ever spoken to Lester Carter before march 24, 1931, I don't remember it. I never saw him before in my life, not as I know of. I left Huntsville some time of the afternoon before the day I claim this trouble happened. I rode on to Chattanooga.
Q: You were going to Chattanooga for what purpose?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: Sustained.
Mr. Leibowitz: exception.
A: I did get to Chattanooga. It was getting along towards dark when the train arrived in Chattanooga. When I got off the train Lester Carter was not with me.
Q: Did you meet a man named Gilley at the train?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: Sustained.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
A: I know Gilley.
Q: Where was the first place you claim that you met Gilley, on the train when you were coming back--had you ever seen Gilley before that time?
A: Not as I remember.
Q: Not that you know of?
A: No, sir.
Q: You hadn't spoken to Gilley in Chattanooga, had you?
A: I probably had and didn't know who he was.
Q: Mr. Price, did you speak to any person in Chattanooga, just "yes" or "no" please?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: Sustained.
Mr. Leibowitz: exception.
Q: Did Gilley bring you some food in Chattanooga?
A: Yes, Sir.
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: I sustain the objection. Gentlemen, she made answer to the question. That is excluded because I have held that the question is illegal.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
Q: I will ask you, Mrs. Price, where you spent the night in--
Mr. Knight: I object to that. Mr. Leibowitz: I am not going to continue this examination if I am to be interrupted.
Court: You are going on with the examination, and I am not going to allow you to be interrupted. Wait until you are certain that he is through with his question, Mr. Attorney General, before you make any objection.
Q: I am going to ask you, Mrs. Price, if you spent the night in Chattanooga in a wooded section near the railroad yards?
Court: I see that you have gone far enough with it, myself, to make that question illegal, and I sustain the objection to it.
Mr. Leibowitz: We except.
Q: I must ask just one more question, don't answer it until objection is made and ruled on by the Court. Did you, there that night, in and about the railroad yards in Chattanooga, have sexual intercourse with one Lester Carter, or one Gilley, in company with Ruby Bates?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: I sustained the objection. Mr. Leibowitz, that question was so palpably illegal that you ought not to have asked a question like that.
Mr. Leibowitz: I except to the admonition of the Court and move for a mistrial.
Court: The motion is overruled
Mr. Leibowitz: Your Honor sustained the objection to the question?
Court: Yes, sir.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
[The testimony then continued:] A. To the best of my recollection, the gondola in which I was riding was right next [to] a box car. To the best of my knowledge, I have told the story that I am telling here now a number of times, as to what happened. I have told it at least eight times in the court from the witness stand. I told it before the grand jury and four times in Scottsboro. I told it before Judge Horton last spring; I told it here the other day, and I am telling it here today.
Q: Did the man by the name of Gilley give you a little box of snuff in Chattanooga?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Court: The objection is sustained.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
A: I was sitting in this gondola, next to the box car, which was behind me. I had my back towards the box car. I was sitting with my back up against the end of the gondola and saw these colored boys jump over my head into that gondola. That was after I left Stevenson. When we boarded that train I never paid any attention whether Lester was on there close to us or not. Me and Ruby Bates did get on the train together. We were not together with Lester Carter and Orville Gilley. We had not been with Lester Carter and Gilley just before we got on the train, all four in a party together. If I was with them, I didn't know who it was. There was several standing there. Me, Gilley, Lester Carter and Ruby Bates did not all four stay together on that train to Stevenson. When the train came to Stevenson, me and Ruby Bates, Lester Carter and Orville Gilley did not leave the train together, or in one crowd. I spoke to some of them that was scattered all around on the oil tank on that train from Chattanooga to Stevenson. I spoke to some boys on the oil tank. I did not have conversation with them. I said good morning to them. At that time I didn't know Lester Carter. I had seen him a time or two, but I didn't know his name.
Q: May I ask this question: Isn't if a fact that you and Lester Carter were together in the very same jail in Huntsville?
Mr. Knight: We object to that.
Mr. Leibowitz: On the question of credibility, you Honor.
Court: I sustain the objection.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
A: I know a man named Jack Tiller. He is my guard, he has been my friend. He is a married man; he used to be. It isn't a fact that after we got into the gondola car and had left Stevenson, me with Gilley, Lester Carter and Ruby Bates, that we four alone got into that gondola. It isn't a fact that while in such gondola car Orville Gilley was lying on the chert singing hobo songs while Lester Carter was blowing on the mouth organ. I did not see or hear Lester Carter blowing a mouth organ at any time on that train. I did not hear Orville Gilley recite any poetry or sing any hobo songs while riding on that train that day. I wouldn't be positive whether I had a snuff box with me. I had snuff in my mouth. I got that snuff out of a snuff box. I did not put that snuff in my mouth while riding on the train. I had put the snuff in my mouth in Chattanooga and that come out of a snuff box. I wouldn't be positive whether I had nay snuff box when I got to the jail that day at Scottsboro....I remained in this gondola all the morning and stayed there until I got off the train after leaving /Stevenson. When these colored boys jumped into the gondola they fought in the same gondola. Ruby Bates and I stood up after the colored boys got on the gondola. We were standing there, twelve of them started to fight with the white boys. Every one of the twelve Negroes were taking part in the fight with the white boys. Right next to us was a box car. It was something like five or ten minutes after the fighting started before the white boys were thrown from the train. I was right close to the end of this car. I had on overalls at that time and a woman's cloak. The cloak had a fur collar. ...I stayed there until the fight was over. I stood there with Ruby Bates. It was then that I claim that I was assaulted, after five or ten minutes standing there (indicating), next to this end of the car. I was interested in watching the fight. I looked at it to see how it was going on. I didn't do anything at that time. I stood there looking at the fight. There was nothing to stop me from getting out from the gondola on to the box car. The colored boys were engaged in the fight with the white boys for five or ten minutes. I saw the white boys being put off the train. My best recollection is that they got off on one side, on the left side looking towards the engine. Well, I wouldn't say positive how many got off on that side. I counted the twelve Negroes, but not as they came into the car. I did not say, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. I did not count them while they were fighting. There was nine in there and three got off. I saw the three get off. That was while I was being raped. They stepped over my head and got on the side of the box car. I did not see them jump to the ground. I know they got out of the gondola, then I counted nine others there. I wasn't unconscious. My mind was clear. I counted them when we got down to Paint Rock. I counted them while I was lying down, not while the raping was goin on--afterwards. I counted them while lying kin'ly on my side. They wasn't all over the car; kin'ly around there pretty close to me; none behind me. Some were in front of me, some on the side of me. I wouldn't be positive how long it was before I got to Paint Rock that I counted them. The raping stopped five or ten or fifteen minutes before we got to Paint Rock. Five minutes or a little over before the train stopped. I did not count them for any particular reason that I had in mind; not so that I would know how may raped me. After they quit raping me and Ruby, I was kin'ly lying on the side. My face was not on the chert. I was not holding my face up. Some of them were large Negroes that intercourse with me; kin'ly heavy; kin'ly rough. Before I got down on the chert, I was hit in the head with a gun. They hit me between my eye and top of my head; hit me along there (indicating). I wouldn't be positive where they hit me. It bled a little bit. It didn't make my head swollen there. Well, it did, a little bit. I don't know the make of any gun. I don't know what calibre means. I don't know a .38 from a .45. I didn't ever know anything about the calibre of any guns at any time in my life. All I know is that he had the barrel in his hand and hit me with the other end. The barrel is the end the smoke come from.
Q: Where did you find that out?
Court: I don't see any use in taking up time with that. I would imagine that anyone with common sense would know which was the barrel of a pistol.
Mr. Leibowitz: I want to except to the Court's statement in reference to the cross-examination.
He hit me with the butt. I don't know which is the butt; I reckon the handle is the butt. The handle is the butt end I know that. I don't know which way the pistol was when he hit me. I probably might have told you the other day that it was the butt end if the gun; I don't know anything about it. Whichever part he hit me with, he hit me on the head between the eyebrow and the top of the head, right along here (indicating) somewhere. When he hit me, some blood came out, a little bit. I was standing up when he hit me. He didn't hit me; he didn't knock me down. He hit me. They was all scuffing around me there. After the man hit me with the butt end of the pistol, which caused a wound on my head that bled a little, I don't know whether he punched me or not; I don't remember.
Q: Way back in Scottsboro you knew something about the calibres of guns, didn't you, "yes" or ["]no" didn't you?
A: I just has been told what they called guns.
Q: You knew all about the calibres of guns in Scottsboro, didn't you?
A: No, sir.
Q: Let's see; the very first trial you testified in, in Scottsboro, hardly a week or ten days after this supposed rape, did you remember testifying before Judge Hawkins?
A: Yes, sir, before Judge Hawkins, I did.
Q: Do you remember being asked these questions and making these answers?: "Q: That one yonder, Charley Weems?
A: Yes, sir. Q. With a gun or pistol? A. A pistol, a .45."
Court: Do you remember whether you said that or not?
A: I probably did, Judge, you Honor...
Q: On the trial before Judge Horton, did you testify--page 64 of the record before Judge Horton--were you asked these questions and did you make these answers: "Q. You lay on you back there for close to an hour on that jagged rock screaming? A. Yes, sit. Q. Was your back bleeding when you got to the doctor? A. I couldn't say. Q. When you got to he jail did you find any blood on you back? A: A little bit." Do you remember saying that?
A: I probably did.
Q: When you said it, it was true?
A: Yes, sir; if I said it, it was the truth, but I don't remember saying it.
Q: Did you find any blood on you back?
A: I have answered you question.
Q: When you got to the jail at Scottsboro and looked yourself over, did you find any blood on your back?
A: I told you I might have. I don't remember. That's been nearly three years ago. I don't know whether this kind of rock that was in the gondola was the king you find down on the railroad track. It was small, more like sand. I didn't look at it that close as to know whether it was different shapes. It wasn't fine sand. I wouldn't try to measure it. I know it is called chert. ...There was one Negro that pushed my head down and kept it down; he pushed me down. I tried to get up. When I was trying to get up he pushed my head back down on the chert. He didn't slam my head down. He kept my head down; he had a knife at my throat. He did not keep my head down with a knife in my face. When he put his hand mon my face he did it kin'ly roughly. He didn't spare me in any way, he wasn't easy with me in any way. They naturally hurt my face. My face wasn't all scratched up. It was scratched a little bit, but not much. My face was bruised all over, kin'ly. I don't know whether or not the first Negro that got on top of me was the one that threw me down. I wouldn't say that the one that threw me down was the first one that raped me or not. Some Negro got on top of me. These Negroes were milling all over the car; they was running up and down the side; some of them raped me and some them Ruby Bates. One or two of these white boys were trying to get back on. While I was being raped some of the Negroes that were not raping me were walking up the side of the car; not to keep the white boys from getting back on; just taking a walk--I saw all that, of course. While that raping was going on the Negro boys were hollering out and laughing and cuttin' up, telling each other to hurry up and get through and let him get to it, and things like that. This coat that I had on had a dark blue lining. It was dark enough so that white spots would show against it. It was a real dark blue. I don't know whether my hips were on that coat while I was being raped or not. I had step-ins on while I was being raped. They had tore them apart. They didn't tear them off my body. Portions of my step-ins were on my body. They have elastic in them. I still had them on while I was being raped. They tore them apart like I said. I had three dresses on, too, while bing raped. When the first man got through having intercourse with me, That didn't wet me all over. It wet me a little bit. IT wet me around my private parts, kin'ly. When the second man got through I was still more wet. When the third man got through I was still a little bit more wet. So that as each man got off me I was more and more wet.
Court: Do you know that of your own knowledge--did you notice at the time that you were, or did you pay any attention to that?
Witness: I didn't pay any attention.
Mr. Leibowitz: I most respectfully except to the Court's question.
Court: It's the Court's business to ask a question at any time during the progress of a trial that he wants to and if you want to reserve an exception the law gives you that right. You have your exception. Go ahead.
A: When the six men finished. I don't remember whether I was real wet or not. I don't say that because of the question asked me by the Judge. I don't remember. That has been nearly three years ago. I am able to identify this Negro that is sitting here by his face. I wouldn't try to point all nine of them out one by one. I know that the defendant was on the gondola. I recognize him after three years. There's lots of things that have happened that will pass from you mind in three years. When they had intercourse with me they were not so rough about it. I don't remember whether my private parts bled. You have asked me that before.
Q: You weren't quite so hazy about it on the last trial when you testified, were you?
A: I was kin'ly bloody, a little bit.
Q: Did you --will you say that blood came out of your private parts onto your clothes?
A: No sir; I don't say it came out on my clothes
Q: On page 65 of the record of the last trial, before Judge Horton last spring, were you not asked this question: "Q. Were you bleeding from you private parts? A. A little bit." Did you say that?
A: I said a little bit. Just before the train got into Paint Rock, I started to adjust my clothes and Gilley helped me to pull on my pants. .I can't answer the question whether Gilley was at any time thrown off that train while I was bing raped. No, sir. They put him off, but he climbed back while the raping was going on. I am sure of that. He climbed back after the other boys had been thrown off. When the attack started and they got all the white boys off he came back in the gondola. When they started attacking us. The very first violence that was done to me was when the grabbed me and asked me was I going to put out, and I say, " no, sir; I don't know what that means," and he says, " You will or die," and I said, " I would rather die." I pushed them back, and when I pushed back, one of them grabbed me and hit me on the head, and pulled me down. The first that grabbed me put his hands on my legs and shoulders and held me over the gondola. I wouldn't say whether it was before or after I was hit. I don't remember whether or not any one of these Negroes grabbed me by the breast when he was raping me. No one grabbed me around the waist while they was raping me. No one of them grabbed me by the private parts or manhandled me in that way. I don't know what pain is to a man. I did suffer pain. They was kinder rough. They didn't tear my insides. I don't know whether they kicked me or not. The skin was torn is several places on my body, on my throat and on my face (indicating); not on my side; also on my back. I had one spot on my leg where it was skinned a little bit. I wouldn't say about where else. I wouldn't say the skin on my stomach was torn. It was bruised; I had some blue spots. It was sore and hurt when you touch it. I don't know whether I was black on my hips or not. They were kin'ly sore afterwards. My back was sore from lying on those rocks. After the train stopped at Paint Rock, I stood up in the gondola. I sat down while it was coming along, until it stopped, and then I got up on the edge when it stopped. I was lying in Gilley's lap until it stopped, with my head in his lap. I put my head in Gilley's lap after the Negroes had quit raping me. That was five or ten minutes before the train stopped. The intercourse was over then. I wasn't doing anything. Ruby was sitting with one of the Negroes with his arms around her neck. I was lying down and she was sitting down. When the train passed the station, I was standing up looking. I don't remember whether the care that I was in passed the station or not. After the train stopped Gilley got up, and after a couple of minutes I got up from lying down. I was sitting up when the train stopped. I was lying down when it stopped, when the train stopped Gilley got out of the car, and I sat up like I am now. I did not continue to lay in the gondola after the train stopped. No sooner then the train stopped than Gilley got out, and I sat up...We were in the gondola next to the box care where the raping took place. I am sure of that. I did not see Gilley standing there. When I got off I fell. I didn't see Gilley before I got off; I didn't look for him. I don't know what happened to Gilley. I fell there beside the gondola. The gondola I was on is the one I fell off. That was the last one next to the box car. It was towards the caboose. After I fell there, I don't know what happened until I got to the store. I was taken tot he store and the doctor was called...The doctors that examined me were Dr. Bridges and R. Lynch. ...Ruby Bates did most of the talking at the doctor's office; I did very little talking....
Re-direct Examination:
These are the step-ins I had on on that occasion (indicating). After this occurrence I washed these step-ins. I washed my clothes the next day, part of them, al of them except my overalls; I wasn't able to wash them. I kept these step-ins in my possession up until the trail held in this court room last spring.
Mr. Bailey: We offer the step-ins in evidence.
Q: Examine this knife, Mrs. Price (hands knife).
Mr. Leibowitz: We are objecting to the introduction of the step-ins. I would not have objected if they had been brought in with all the direct and stuff on them. Bout when she brings in something that she later washed, I am objecting to their introduction.
Court: The objection is overruled.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
A: That is my knife. I had a knife in this gondola during the occurrence I have testified about. One of these Negroes taken it off'n me. The next time I saw the knife was in the court room at Scottsboro. One of the law had it then. Mr. Woodall brought my knife out to the court room.
Q: Mr. Woodall brought the knife out of the court room?
A: Yes, sir; they asked me if that was my knife.
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to that.
Court: Overruled.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
Q: That is the time you next saw it?
A: Yes, sir.
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to that.
Court: Overruled.
Mr. Leibowitz: Exception.
Q: That is the time you next say it?
A: Yes, sir.
Court: About the step-ins, of course you will have to follow that up and show that they are in the same condition they were in at the time she washed them.
That garment is in the same condition now as it was when brought into court back in the spring, in this court room. They are in the same condition they were in immediately after the rape, except that I have washed them. The knife is in the same condition.
Mr. Leibowitz: We object to the knife.
Mr. Bailey: She has identified the knife and testified that one of these defendants took the knife away from her.
Court: The step-ins are in evidence, but I will exclude the knife for the present.
Re-Cross Examination: There was four hands grabbed me (indicating), this way, to tear these drawers apart. I don't know whether they scratched me in the crotch or not in ripping these thing open this way. There was few scratches to the best of my remembrance, I never paid no attention to whether I bled from the scratches when they ripped the drawers apart. ... I hit some of them until they held me. I don't know whether I kicked some of them or not. I don't remember. I did not tear the clothes of any of them. I did not put up a fierce battle. I don't remember being asked before Judge Horton whether when Dr. Bridge and Dr. Lynch examined me they saw my coat at that time and it was all spattered over with semen. I don't remember whether I answered, "Yes, sir." I don't think I made that statement.